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functional.cafe is an instance for people interested in functional programming and languages.

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Thing I don’t get is people believing that hydrogen is going to be a useful automotive fuel. Are they all oil company shills?

Hydrogen is an objectively terrible fuel for pretty much any use with the possible exception of aviation.

It has abysmal energy density for a given volume, even if you liquify it (compare Falcon heavy to Delta IV heavy: similar lift capacities but the latter is fucking enormous because hydrogen takes up stupid amounts of space and the former runs on kerosene).

It doesn’t stay where you put it, ever. It’s literally impossible to keep hydrogen in a container. A hydrogen molecule is so small that it will fuck off through the gaps in soils iron. You cannot store it long term.

To get ANY kind of sensible energy density from it, you have to liquify it (where it’s still shit compared to pretty much any other energy source in the same volume), and that’s cold. Seriously, seriously, mind bendingly cold. It makes liquid nitrogen look like lava.

Oil companies like it because atom for atom, crude oil is mostly hydrogen. Go figure.

But it’s an objectively dreadful fuel. Stop trying to make hydrogen a thing. It’s never going to be (again, planes maybe excepted).

@goatsarah 99% agree with you - hydrogen for any consumer application is stupid - electricity (via batteries were required) will always make more efficient use assuming the bulk of our energy is coming from renewable electricity in some form or other.

No opinion one way or the other on hydrogen in aviation. Maybe alcohol or ammonia? Dunno.

Hydrogen for grid-scale semi-interseasonal energy storage does seem to make some sense to me, though. L²/L³ is on your side if you're storing enough of the stuff. OK, the round-trip efficiency isn't great but I don't really see any other way of storing multiple TWh over weeks or months.

The Dutch government seems to have big plans in that direction. They must make at least a bit of sense, even if they're over-affected by the proximity of Shell or whoever.

A reminder for me to re-read Chris Goodall's The Switch, I think.

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@edavies [functional.cafe] for storage, I’m a big fan of pumping water uphill into big lakes. This may be an issue for the Dutch government in particular. They have many lakes, but not doing so well in the hills department!